right elbow at top of swing

[gmbtempe]

This is a total newbie question so I apologize in advance but I am a little confused on the term "punch" elbow. I am very new to the the pricnicples of TGM, let alone "hitting", are much differnt than I had been told in previous instruction.

When I would take my backswing in my previous swinging motion to club paralell at the top (end I believe its called) I would keep my right elbow very close to my right side, I had little to no flying right elbow.

Now in hitting I stop the club in a much shorter position but have not adjusted the elbow position. I would say the angle bewteen the shaft and my forarm is about 100-110 degrees.

I was playing around with keeping the forearm at a perpendicular angle to the shaft, to do this the elbow as to detach for the left side more. In a shorter hitting stroke it certainly felt more powerful. I took some pictures of the two. I don't know if this is something that I should be trying to do or not. Like the forum in the background

old elbow


adjusted elbow

[Richie3Jack]

Punch Elbow and Pitch elbow are positions of the elbow in the downstroke.

Punch elbow has the elbow in the downstroke 'behind and to the side' of the right hip on the downswing. Pitch elbow has the elbow 'out in front' of the right hip on the downswing. Hogan is a classic example of using 'pitch elbow.' Hitters tend to use punch elbow.

As far as the right elbow goes on the backswing. The way I looked at it is that on the downswing, the right elbow has to get pretty close to the right rib cage and the right hip, regardless if you are using pitch elbow or punch elbow.

In the backswing, that's a different story. Guys like Couples and Nicklaus and countless others had the right elbow quite aways away from the right rib cage. Guys like Hogan had it pretty close to the right rib cage at the top of the swing.

I used to be more of the Nicklaus and Couples mode when it came ot the right elbow at the top of the swing. On plane, but no real consistency. Then I started experimenting with keeping the right elbow 'nearby' the rib cage at the top of the swing and saw major improvement in my ballstriking.

I believe it's just a case that the guys like Nicklaus and Couples with the 'flying right elbow' are just very adept to returning that right elbow into a good position, nearby the right rib cage and hip joint time and time again on the downstroke. Guys like myself and Hogan, if we get the right elbow away from the rib cage at the top of the swing, we have a lot of difficulty returning it to a quality position near the rib cage and hip joint on the downswing. So we're better off not letting it get away from the right rib cage to begin with.




3JACK

[gmbtempe]

Thanks, I played around with this, it did not work out so well. I think it goes against the natural motion I have developed.

[Richie3Jack]

That's pretty normal. I wouldn't tell Couples that he needs to get his right elbow closer to his rib cage at the top of the swing or tell Hogan that he needs to get his right elbow further away from the rib cage. Experimenting for a little bit doesn't really hurt, but you do have to trust that your natural motion may be the best way for you and that trying somebody else's motion because it looks prettier or whatever could be a disaster.





3JACK

[Daryl]

That's pretty normal. I wouldn't tell Couples that he needs to get his right elbow closer to his rib cage at the top of the swing or tell Hogan that he needs to get his right elbow further away from the rib cage. Experimenting for a little bit doesn't really hurt, but you do have to trust that your natural motion may be the best way for you and that trying somebody else's motion because it looks prettier or whatever could be a disaster.





3JACK

Natural Motion?

Who said:

Reverse every natural instinct and do the opposite of what you are inclined to do, and you will probably come very close to having a perfect golf swing.

Is Pole Vaulting natural? A Football Block? Hammer Throw? Is a Back Flip Natural? Each of these things need to be learned and practiced. Added together they don't amount to 1/10th the complexity of a Golf Swing.

Who Said:

It is a difficult game, in that total perfection is virtually unattainable because the Golf Stroke is fantastically complex and implacably demanding of mechanical precision – whether consciously or subconsciously applied – and ruthlessly deviates with every slightest stretching of tolerances during application.

And:

Treating a complex subject or action as though it were simple, multiplies its complexity because of the difficulty in systematizing missing and unknown factors and elements. Demanding that golf instruction be kept simple does not make it simple – only incomplete and ineffective. Unless this is recognized, golf remains vague, frustrating, infuriating form of exertion.

And:

I asked my good friend, Arnold Palmer how I could improve my game, he advised me to Cheat!

[Richie3Jack]

So, would you advise Jack and Freddy if they came to you for advise to get their right elbow closer to their rib cage? Or would you tell Hogan that he needs some space there between the rib cage and the right elbow?




3JACK