Pivot axis center - where is it?

[h.kan]

Since I started to learn golf I have learnt and always imagine that the pivot take place around the spine. So in sketch 1-L the top of the pole would be the head and the base should be between the foots but a little bit back.
Struggling with lower back pain the last 2-3 years I have been in search for the “painless” swing. That’s one of the reasons I started to learn TGM.
Thinking about this problem and using some old biomechanic knowledge I posses, I realised that the spine is actually not built to be a god “rotator” actually it is built to be very stable and it can rotate only a fragment in each segment(one vertebra). And only when all these segment is cooperating there is still barely enough rotation for the golfswing.

I started to experiment and soon I ended up with rotating above/around my left hipjoint. Now the hipjoint is in contrast to the spine a structure that is made to let the body freely rotate around itself.
So what I´m experimenting with is to have the base of the pole in 1-L at my left fot and then the pole goes through the hipjoint and up towards the head. I´m trying to keep this axis of rotation both in my backswing, down and throughswing!
In this way the spine will not twist but just rotate around the axis and actually it gives me a less painfull swing. It also helps me to come more from the inside and my shoots are straighter and longer. It prevent swaying and bobbing and my left knee don’t wander away to the right. It simplify the swing and that’s a great thing…….. right Homer?
Yesterday I hit two drives in the vicinity of 270 yards, never happend before.

To get a feeling of what I´m speaking off try this out.
1 put all weight on the left leg, just keep the right big toe in the ground as a balance help, do your swing back and forth, feel how you are pivoting above the hip
2 then pivot around the spine and compare how restrained this is, the shoulder turn is limited compared to 1.

I imagine (I don’t know) that the hipslide (hulahula) action in TGM actually transfer the axis of pivot to go through the hipjoint but I cant find that information in the book.

I have explained this to a couple of friends and they have never heard anything like this, ever, so I like to know what you all think. Snares? Any does or don’t? Or maybee this is just a blind alley or what?
håkan

[lagster]

Since I started to learn golf I have learnt and always imagine that the pivot take place around the spine. So in sketch 1-L the top of the pole would be the head and the base should be between the foots but a little bit back.
Struggling with lower back pain the last 2-3 years I have been in search for the “painless” swing. That’s one of the reasons I started to learn TGM.
Thinking about this problem and using some old biomechanic knowledge I posses, I realised that the spine is actually not built to be a god “rotator” actually it is built to be very stable and it can rotate only a fragment in each segment(one vertebra). And only when all these segment is cooperating there is still barely enough rotation for the golfswing.

I started to experiment and soon I ended up with rotating above/around my left hipjoint. Now the hipjoint is in contrast to the spine a structure that is made to let the body freely rotate around itself.
So what I´m experimenting with is to have the base of the pole in 1-L at my left fot and then the pole goes through the hipjoint and up towards the head. I´m trying to keep this axis of rotation both in my backswing, down and throughswing!
In this way the spine will not twist but just rotate around the axis and actually it gives me a less painfull swing. It also helps me to come more from the inside and my shoots are straighter and longer. It prevent swaying and bobbing and my left knee don’t wander away to the right. It simplify the swing and that’s a great thing…….. right Homer?
Yesterday I hit two drives in the vicinity of 270 yards, never happend before.

To get a feeling of what I´m speaking off try this out.
1 put all weight on the left leg, just keep the right big toe in the ground as a balance help, do your swing back and forth, feel how you are pivoting above the hip
2 then pivot around the spine and compare how restrained this is, the shoulder turn is limited compared to 1.

I imagine (I don’t know) that the hipslide (hulahula) action in TGM actually transfer the axis of pivot to go through the hipjoint but I cant find that information in the book.

I have explained this to a couple of friends and they have never heard anything like this, ever, so I like to know what you all think. Snares? Any does or don’t? Or maybee this is just a blind alley or what?
håkan

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Very interesting!!!

I understand your quest for a pain free swing.

In TGM the center of the Pivot is the HEAD. The center of the actual stroke is the LEFT SHOULDER, or could be the(right elbow).

Now...the things you are talking about are a little different.
The Pivotal Axis for most strokes(on the DOWNSWING) is probably in the(left)lead hip(runs from the left heel up to the left hip). It could be in the trail hip, because it will rotate also, but this probably would require several adjustments to make this work well for most shots.

It sounds like what you are talking about is kind of a SHIFTLESS Pivot. I have also heard something like this called a "No Transfer" procedure.

David Lee gives his explanation of some of thse things in his "Gravity Golf."

Hopefully... others will help out on this one!!

[DOCW3]

When it is working for you, I would video from different angles. Martin Green/Peter Croker (TGM through Tomasello) would be a source having the bottom of the spine closer to the target at address. Also, there was a recent article in Golf Tips where the pivot positions the left hip closer to the target at the "Top" with a spine tilt. The hips just rotate into delivery and there is no subsequent slide. Darren Clarke could be an example. However there is head movement in the latter and the head is not centered in the former. I would think your challenge would be identifying a pattern with TGM components.

Some book references:

1-L: "The mechanical device has no balance problem but the human machine does, and mastery of the Pivot (Zone#1) is so essential for good Golf."
1-L.1: "The Stationary Post (players head)...."
2-H: "The spine between the shoulders is the center of the Shoulder Turn......Through the Head" Pivot Center is recommended, it is not at all mandatory......On Plane Right Shoulder Motion is possible only by tilting its axis-the spine."
7-12: "ALL motion-Pivot and Power Package-moves parallel to the selected Delivery Line. That is, prior to the Downstroke Turn, a Slide parallel with either the Angle of Approach or the Plane Line..."
9-1: "The Pivot involves twisting the body and shifting the weight during the Stroke so as to maintain balance, a motionless head and any required tilt of the torso."

DRW